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Post by Pleonast on Mar 13, 2013 10:40:42 GMT -8
Redirecting protections is useful, in general. But when there's only one killer out there, and they're known, redirecting the killer is much more useful.
The game will continue for a while. The Devils can win when they're all dead under any of the victory conditions, but #1 and #2 would also require everyone else dead.
And the others won't know all the Devils are dead, so they're probably be at least one or two more lynches. Still, it will be very hard for the Devils to win.
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Post by texcat on Mar 13, 2013 18:55:05 GMT -8
And the others won't know all the Devils are dead, so they're probably be at least one or two more lynches. Still, it will be very hard for the Devils to win. The Devils do know quite a few CSins. I worry that may be enough of an advantage to let them win -- even dead. Has crys given up trying to contact the dead? ETA: And yay! Colby unvoted Moley so as to not get a sin! I wish he had unvoted me when I was begging the sinless to unvote.
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Post by polluxoil on Mar 13, 2013 20:46:58 GMT -8
The thing that could save the game, ironically, is if Idle ever actually ends up in Purgatory. If he stays there, it might help keep people who the Devils have nailed safe. However, Idle is so insistent on going to Heaven (and the Devils will never kill him since they know who he is) that'll probably not work.
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 14, 2013 11:30:05 GMT -8
Now, the game gets interesting, I think. How long will guiri last? How clever will the Devils be with any claimed souls? 11 town vs 1 scum seems lopsided, but a lot could still happen.
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Post by lauriern on Mar 14, 2013 15:35:32 GMT -8
Paranoia's posts to the Devils in Hell are making me smile
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Post by polluxoil on Mar 14, 2013 17:33:23 GMT -8
Devils are making a mistake right now, being more worried about the kill going through than claiming Moley's soul. They should be using guiri's power to block Ginger instead of blocking protects. But since Ginger's praying for Moley, he'll stick around in Purgatory. At the very least, crys may have somebody to talk to for a Night, for once.
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Post by lightfoot on Mar 14, 2013 19:14:43 GMT -8
it appears they have Moley's sin so off to hell for them
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 15, 2013 7:23:47 GMT -8
Well, guiri is going to die unless they change their mind to blocking kills.
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Post by polluxoil on Mar 15, 2013 11:35:19 GMT -8
Now's where it gets interesting. Nothing but Town left. Essentially they're going to be lynching/killing themselves at this point, so it's a matter of having souls in Purgatory get to heaven.
My guess is they'll start with the Heretics and Pagans.
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Post by polluxoil on Mar 15, 2013 11:38:19 GMT -8
Also question for Pleonast:
Ginger prayed for Moley. Her power reads:
Each Night you may pray for another living or dead player. This will reduce their sins by half. If you target a living player, they cannot be recruited that Night. If you target a dead player, their soul cannot be claimed by a Devil that Night. You will also learn where a dead player's soul is.
So why did CatinaSuit get Holy Moley's soul? What am I missing?
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 15, 2013 11:58:05 GMT -8
Also question for Pleonast: Ginger prayed for Moley. Her power reads: Each Night you may pray for another living or dead player. This will reduce their sins by half. If you target a living player, they cannot be recruited that Night. If you target a dead player, their soul cannot be claimed by a Devil that Night. You will also learn where a dead player's soul is.So why did CatinaSuit get Holy Moley's soul? What am I missing? Doh, that would be mod error. Always the risk with complex games. It's not really reversible, either. I hope that's not the one thing that determines the game's outcome. We're close to calling the game in favor of the non-Devils. I think we have to let Day Nine play out, but after that, it might be best to end it. Any comments on how long we should let it go?
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Post by texcat on Mar 15, 2013 12:09:35 GMT -8
Town needs 1 more person in Heaven for a win?
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 15, 2013 12:24:36 GMT -8
One more player in Heaven will stop the Devils' third win condition. They could also win if all the players are dead and they get two more souls. But that will be very hard unless patricia consistently gets their bonus kill from claiming souls.
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 15, 2013 20:24:34 GMT -8
Also question for Pleonast: Ginger prayed for Moley. Her power reads: Each Night you may pray for another living or dead player. This will reduce their sins by half. If you target a living player, they cannot be recruited that Night. If you target a dead player, their soul cannot be claimed by a Devil that Night. You will also learn where a dead player's soul is.So why did CatinaSuit get Holy Moley's soul? What am I missing? Doh, that would be mod error. Always the risk with complex games. It's not really reversible, either. I hope that's not the one thing that determines the game's outcome. We're close to calling the game in favor of the non-Devils. I think we have to let Day Nine play out, but after that, it might be best to end it. Any comments on how long we should let it go? On further thought, it's not such a horrible mistake, because guiri was blocking all non-Devil manipulation powers. The protection from soul-claiming is manipulation.
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 19, 2013 11:29:21 GMT -8
Things have slowed down a lot. :yawn:
I'm a little surprised that no one has voted for No Lynch.
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Post by texcat on Mar 19, 2013 12:45:22 GMT -8
I was guessing that they'd look at Idle again. But I agree it's slow.
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Post by polluxoil on Mar 20, 2013 10:26:31 GMT -8
On further thought, it's not such a horrible mistake, because guiri was blocking all non-Devil manipulation powers. The protection from soul-claiming is manipulation. According to her role in the role thread, she's listed as Mechanic. But I'm not going to put up a huge fuss because it's already happened, and I know how hard it is to manage a complex game. Stuff like this always ends up happening the more roles and rules there are. So it's fine. This is an interesting position for Town to be in, though, because literally to win they have to vote No Lynch and stop killing people. But Town, in every other Mafia game, is conditioned that the lynch is a Town advantage and they have to keep lynching until they've succeeded at victory. The only hint they have to that in the first place is that their win condition isn't exactly spelled out for them as all Devils being dead = victory. With the recruiting red herring, the non-Christian roles, and typical Mafia mindset of Town, I'm fairly certain it's impossible for the Devils to lose at this point if the game continues. I just don't think the Town has enough information at their disposal to make the call of not killing anyone else.
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 20, 2013 11:30:18 GMT -8
I'm very close to calling the game in favor of non-Devils. In order to win with victory conditions 1 or 2, all players need to be dead. That is extremely difficult. The only way is for Death to claim souls and kill. Otherwise, town will stop lynching at some point.
For the 3rd victory condition, Devils cannot lose any more souls. This will also be hard.
The problem is that getting to the point of a conclusive game state may take a while. And I'm not sure the gameplay is interesting enough to justify continuing it.
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Post by texcat on Mar 20, 2013 11:52:16 GMT -8
Crys and Jan were both lynched? How did that happen?
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 20, 2013 11:59:09 GMT -8
War's bonus power for claiming a soul.
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 21, 2013 7:22:14 GMT -8
On further thought, it's not such a horrible mistake, because guiri was blocking all non-Devil manipulation powers. The protection from soul-claiming is manipulation. Since I mistakenly used this interpretation on Night Eight to the Devil's benefit, I will again use it on Night Nine to the non-Devil's benefit.
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 21, 2013 9:17:26 GMT -8
There'll be a lot of disappointed players on Night Nine. Everyone is blocked except the killer, who makes an own goal.
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Post by Pleonast on Mar 21, 2013 11:32:02 GMT -8
So, is it time to stop the game with non-Devils as the winner?
The Devils are likely to think that their Cardinal Sin guesses were wrong, rather than blocked. So it's very unlikely they will manage to get silverjan or crys. If either one gets to Heaven, then Devil Win Condition 3 is out.
That leaves conditions 1 and 2. Either of those require 2 more souls, which isn't hard. What is hard is making dead all 7 of the remaining living players. While still possible, with the failure to claim souls on Night Nine, it's going to be a long slog.
I'm thinking that if the living players vote No Lynch for Day Ten, then I'll end the game with non-Devils winning. Any comments?
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Post by polluxoil on Mar 22, 2013 11:03:42 GMT -8
The problem is the living players are never going to willingly vote No Lynch. Especially since the first half of the game was just as light on scum kills as now, as you can see from their habit.
There just isn't enough solid information on their parts for them to think "maybe we've got all the Devils already and to win we need to stop killing ourselves." They're just going to continue to be suspicious of each other.
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Post by texcat on Mar 27, 2013 15:50:54 GMT -8
The good news is that Ryjae can't be killed for trying to cleanse a Devil. The bad news is that she can't seem to cleanse any Christians. I was hoping that she'd be able to clear a few more people and they might be able catch on that all the Devils were dead.
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